7AGE

[mandm177]

mckenney...please share! who has this?

i was planning on doing a 7a with my spare BT head...

[McKenney]

Trade secret my friend... Call me or text me later and I'll let you know.

[Sam-Q]

I thought it would be interference because the FE head has a 22 degree valve angle with recessed valves vs the 50 of the 16V 4age. This will very likely mean the edges of the valves would hit. Also what I suspected was right, I had a look and the ring lands of 7afe pistons are thin, I wouldn't be giving them boost myself

[McKenney]

Hence why I asked. I wasnt sure and don't want to invest the time if not worth it. So ZE pistons then?

[Sam-Q]

yes I suggest it, you then need to make the choice on which model of pistons on how much boost you want to run

[McKenney]

Thank you Sam, and sorry Nomuken about the thread jack!

[nomuken]

So i started this thread and now I wanted to show some numbers. I finished my 7AGE on ITB's project.
7AFE block and lightened OEM crank
Belfab conrods
Wiseco pistons
Largeport head with Kelford cams and TODA springs
Head is port matched and has some 20V BT ITB's
Haltech engine management system.
Engine has done about 1000miles, has been dyno mapped and it survived it's first trackday last Friday. It produces 147rwhp. Here it is compared to my old 16V setup and my even older 20V setup. All on the same car and the same dyno:

[dr.occa]

Nomuken, thanks for the great update.

Looks like your 20v put down almost 10hp more but later on.

[McKenney]

What pistons? Compression? etc...

[mooreofit]

is the spike at 7800 a true reading?

the 20v didnt look like it was done at 8000.

very cool.how much timing did you get in it at wot and any future runs past 8000?

[nomuken]

is the spike at 7800 a true reading?

I would say no, guess it's more a thing of hitting the limiter and freaking the dyno or the operator or somethin. Limiter was set on fuet cut wich is quite rough. I now set the limiter to work via ignition. Way smoother

the 20v didnt look like it was done at 8000.

Yeah, the 20V could have gone a bit further, but 8300 is enough on a stock bottom end

very cool.how much timing did you get in it at wot and any future runs past 8000?

Maximum advance is about 37°. It might not be on the edge, but regarding the 11.6:1 compression and the fact that this engines priority is to last and even run on a daily basis, I decided it's enough. Maybe I'll get knock control one day,...

[McKenney]

Awesome man... still curious as to what pistons you're using and rods as well. Stock 7AFE rods???

[mandm177]

What mods (if any) were done with the 20v?

Which engine do you prefer?

Very curious, cause i was thinking about building a 7age with my spare 20v BT head, but i was really surprised with the numbers...do you have any torque numbers?

[mooreofit]

no doubt, a set of arp rod bolts would fix that though. oil starvation is not as prevelent on a dyno as it is the on the track. just keep an eye on the oil pressure.

37* is quite a bit. det cans are pretty easy to make. i run till i hear knock then pull 4* i cant get more than 15* on 91. i can get 24* on 116.bout a hundred horse difference too. on my chevy.

[nomuken]

Awesome man... still curious as to what pistons you're using and rods as well. Stock 7AFE rods???

Technotoy/Belfab 7AFE conrods with ARP bolts
Wiseco 81.5mm 11,5:1 Pistons (compression would have been way over 12:1 in the 7AGE, so I used a 1.6mm HKS headgasket to drop it a bit. I'm now around 11.5:1

What mods (if any) were done with the 20v?
Which engine do you prefer?

20V had some high lift camshafts (from catcams), TODA valve springs, 0.7mm power entreprises headgasket, open trumpets, new bearings everywhere, Fidanza flywheel and a balanced crank. Might have forgotten somethin?!

I prefer the 7AGE, it feels like it's producing the power easier. The parts (4AGE and 7AFE) are way more easy to find here in europe. And a 4AGE (head) has that oldschool and underdog side. Everybody thinks you are pushing big numbers when you got a 20V in your car. I had 2 stock 20V Blacktops. One had 150 crank hp the other had 153. So it's way to pricey and to much hassle to have.
But yes, sometimes I miss the revving ability of a 20V. And a 7AGE 20V should be pretty bad ass. Wouldn't solve the price tag or the availability problem, but badass none the less.

As far as the torque readings go, here's a Excel graph of both engines, # are in european Nm (Newton meter), so you'll have to convert.
Edit: I googled it out of curiosity, my max torque an the 7AGE is 130 lb-ft. So after all I'm +57 crank hp and +33 crank lb-ft over my good old standard 4AGE

Max torque on the 7AGE is 176Nm
on the 20V it was 171Nm